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Author Topic: Digression about VC inaccuracy  (Read 598 times)

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Sherkel

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Re: Digression about VC inaccuracy
« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2019, 07:41:07 pm »
I feel that the use of VC should be strongly discouraged whenever it is seen, to prevent frivolous "glitches" and questions.

Seeing the use of VC makes it difficult to determine whether or not the issue lies with an actual problem with the ACE code/glitch itself, or VC's terrible emulation accuracy.
I think it should be indicated when it's being used, but posters generally haven't had a problem with that. Discouraging it would be fairly futile, because as some have pointed out, those are still official versions of the games.

I can inject a ROM into RetroArch's Gambatte core, and it becomes a standalone game, like VC. It looks a lot like an actual VC game. If they extract the ROM from a copy of the actual VC title, I can just do this for them, they can install it, and can pull their save too.

Hell, I can even add more features, like rapid-fire, screenshots, fast forward, custon controls, rewind (N3DS/N2DS only), all kinds of good s**t.

there's no real loss to it, and it makes the game accurate.

i'll probably extend these services to those using stock VC, since i'd require an extracted ROM from a VC title.
No offense intended, but is this anything that a combination of HackingToolkit9DS and Super Ultimate Injector can't do?

It's nice to see you offer help regardless, and I'm sure if anyone has trouble working with those to get their ROM and save onto something like BGB and then back to their 3DS, they'd want to have someone to ask about it.

As a final note,
I'm curious to know if there are any VC emulation accuracy problems that can be actually observed in regular gameplay (not talking about glitches, ACE or such) compared to real hardware or more accurate third party emulators for Crystal?
As far as I know, it's next to none, if any. Emulators are written to do their job. I don't want VC to be frowned upon just for its own sake.

Issues only come up when changing how the code functions from a base level, which is limited to glitching. (Timing too, but that's not relevant here). Gonna go make that post now.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2019, 09:04:51 pm by Sherkel »

Kind of on hiatus for the next few weeks at least, but I always come back and in the meantime would like to encourage discussion on how the site is organized so as to let visitors find the most useful info (whatever that may be) in a clean and efficient fashion.
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ISSOtm

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Re: Digression about VC inaccuracy
« Reply #16 on: March 31, 2019, 11:39:01 pm »
As a final note,
I'm curious to know if there are any VC emulation accuracy problems that can be actually observed in regular gameplay (not talking about glitches, ACE or such) compared to real hardware or more accurate third party emulators for Crystal?
As far as I know, it's next to none, if any. Emulators are written to do their job. I don't want VC to be frowned upon just for its own sake.

Issues only come up when changing how the code functions from a base level, which is limited to glitching. (Timing too, but that's not relevant here). Gonna go make that post now.
Emulation inaccuracies, maybe not, but keep in mind the ROMs played through the VC are patched.
There's plenty of reasons to do frown upon VC because of it not doing its job. Code has been changed to work in the emulator, which is a hack. And, all code run by the CPU in the context of this official ROM is legit, hence ACE is valid and not a consequence of "changing how the code functions from a base level", however that understands it.

And finally, keep in mind that VC can brick your 3DS easily, so, yeah. Please refer to this :)
« Last Edit: April 13, 2019, 01:13:23 pm by ISSOtm »
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Sherkel

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Re: Digression about VC inaccuracy
« Reply #17 on: March 31, 2019, 11:51:34 pm »
I'll add some of that to the sticky. Thanks.

By the quoted part, I meant something closer to "changing what the code does", if intentionally setting particular bytes in RAM based on assembly instructions can be considered a "base level", which is how I've generally described it for ACE.

I definitely need to look up the bricking issue, as I hadn't heard of that.

Kind of on hiatus for the next few weeks at least, but I always come back and in the meantime would like to encourage discussion on how the site is organized so as to let visitors find the most useful info (whatever that may be) in a clean and efficient fashion.
I don't have a habit of keeping Discord open, so direct inquiries are still preferred through here.

Bert

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Re: Digression about VC inaccuracy
« Reply #18 on: March 31, 2019, 11:56:16 pm »
How come my post was moved here? The timing difference I mentioned was on the cartridges, too.

Sherkel

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Re: Digression about VC inaccuracy
« Reply #19 on: April 01, 2019, 12:04:20 am »
Because I had thought it was due to VC differences.

Kind of on hiatus for the next few weeks at least, but I always come back and in the meantime would like to encourage discussion on how the site is organized so as to let visitors find the most useful info (whatever that may be) in a clean and efficient fashion.
I don't have a habit of keeping Discord open, so direct inquiries are still preferred through here.

ISSOtm

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Re: Digression about VC inaccuracy
« Reply #20 on: April 01, 2019, 12:19:41 pm »

I definitely need to look up the bricking issue, as I hadn't heard of that.
Well, that's because it was an April Fools! Think of it as a... brick joke
"THOU SHALL NOT PASS !!"  RIVAL's effect, Gandalf.

Proudly glitching Pokémon Red and Yellow on a Black & White GB, Pocket GB, GB Color, GBA SP and new 3DS.

My Twitter (beware, I'm French)
My YouTube (same warning)

Here is an online tool to build 8F setups : GBz80 to Items !

They see me layzin', they ha-tin'...
Heavy contributor of the global augmentation of entropy (my room's is too damn high !)

Sherkel

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Re: Digression about VC inaccuracy
« Reply #21 on: April 01, 2019, 03:42:35 pm »

I definitely need to look up the bricking issue, as I hadn't heard of that.
Well, that's because it was an April Fools! Think of it as a... brick joke
That reminds me of when I found a clothing store with clothes made entirely out of bricks. Everyone called it a hard-wear store. I wanted to forget about it, but it's just been cemented in my memory.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2019, 03:49:47 pm by Sherkel »

Kind of on hiatus for the next few weeks at least, but I always come back and in the meantime would like to encourage discussion on how the site is organized so as to let visitors find the most useful info (whatever that may be) in a clean and efficient fashion.
I don't have a habit of keeping Discord open, so direct inquiries are still preferred through here.